I don't think Loren is presented as being lesbian, but that the acts like one due to Amazon culture. Think of ancient Greece, where male homosexuality was rampant. If culture can pressure all those men into liking other men, then I am sure it can pressure Loren into liking women. She, just like the Greeks, is probably (probably, because ~90% are) heterosexual, but society can seemingly convince you to be homosexual or at least bi. I don't know how the hell it works but I don't believe all those Greek men were genuinely gay.
MadanceJan 27, 2014
Valhallen, the scene is in the game, regardless of the path taken, so my point still stands. Like you, I can always headcanon a different turn of events(and I do. To me Loren isn't straight and the bad ending didn't exactly happened that way), but the scene is in the game, whether we like it or not.
Jack, listen, I do understand the need in making her swing both ways, if she was presented in a different light, I would have no problem. It was stated during the game that the amazons usually used men for pleasure or mating, so if Loren actually showed during the game some interest in those aspects(I don't know, like the nynph scene in the elf path, she could, during the human path; express that she used the male slaves for pleasure, for example)she wouldn't be presented as a lesbian, but as bisexual, and the argument of "turning her straight" would be gone, but such thing was not present in the game. We could always headcanon that she did use the male slaves for such things, but there isn't any mention of it during the game.
If Loren didn't have the nymph scene, she could even be a straight romance, actually being attracted to males but being afraid of expressing this, since the amazons considered them only tools to be used, and she didn't want to be rejected by them.
Those a few suggestions how things could have been. I'm not even saying that the wrong message was actually intended, but this is what it became. I'm only giving my feed back, for the future. Please, I don't misunderstand me.
jack1974Jan 27, 2014
OK I think I got it. Thanks for explaining better!
In next games such things will also pop-up during the beta so will be possible to tweak/change small details and make them better with good feedback like yours
MadanceJan 27, 2014
Thank you! I'm glad we could finish this discussion(I'm terrible at it ). I want to add that I'm truly glad we could talk to you and express our opinions. You rock, Jack!
ValHallenJan 27, 2014
Valhallen, the scene is in the game, regardless of the path taken, so my point still stands. Like you, I can always headcanon a different turn of events(and I do. To me Loren isn't straight and the bad ending didn't exactly happened that way), but the scene is in the game, whether we like it
No it doesnt, in human path it will not happen, in fact I didnt even knew it could happen because I never played the elf path
MadanceJan 27, 2014
I'm sorry, I'm not really following what you said?
MiakodaJan 27, 2014
No it doesnt, in human path it will not happen, in fact I didnt even knew it could happen because I never played the elf path
Actually, it can happen on Saren's path, but if you flee to the woods.
After Myrth brings out the nymphs, it says, "Saren felt a burning sensation in his chest at the thought of his mistress with these...nymphs." Then the normal '3 choices come up'. If you pick Joking or Friendly, Loren does leave with the nymphs. If you pick Forceful, Saren says "Isn't this rather inappropriate", elaborating Loren needs to rest. Loren agrees with his assessment, and stays away from the nymphs.
ValHallenJan 27, 2014
I'm sorry, I'm not really following what you said?
The nymph scene doesnt happen in the humano path
Since I only played the human path, I didnt even know this acne before I read it here
MiakodaJan 27, 2014
I'm sorry, I'm not really following what you said?
The nymph scene doesnt happen in the humano path
Since I only played the human path, I didnt even know this acne before I read it here
I think I have it figured out. When you say Human path, did you perhaps stay in the Empire, following Dora's suggestion? (The one where you get Apolimesho and Amukiki, and gain the Ember Blade).
If you follow Draco's idea, running to the elves, then that is where the Nymph scene Madance is talking about.
So, depending on which route you went, I can see how it would change one's perception of Loren.
MadanceJan 27, 2014
Yes, that exactly what I meant, Miakoda, thanks. ^__^
No matter how you put it, the game makes clear that Loren have an attraction to females. Anyway... I won't repeat myself again, sorry, no offense. It's getting a bit out of hand and I'm really a bit embarrassed over the size of this discussion. So, let's just agree to disagree to avoid further discussions, at least in this thread?
megaman12321Jan 27, 2014
Yes, that exactly what I meant, Miakoda, thanks. ^__^
No matter how you put it, the game makes clear that Loren have an attraction to females. Anyway... I won't repeat myself again, sorry, no offense. It's getting a bit out of hand and I'm really a bit embarrassed over the size of this discussion. So, let's just agree to disagree to avoid further discussions, at least in this thread?
Considering how internet discussions usually go, this is still pretty tame and level-headed, thankfully. In any case, this whole issue is really just based off interpretation. Granted, the WW team didn't mean to create it like the way Loren was interpreted and have this issue be addressed, but it was accident. Thankfully, the issue will be addressed next game to avoid implications.
I thought it was just plain called the Human and Elves Path. Was it always Empire?
MiakodaJan 27, 2014
I thought it was just plain called the Human and Elves Path. Was it always Empire?
I mentioned the Empire specifically to hopefully be clear.
I admit, when I think of Human Path, and Elf Path, my mind equates playing as Saren as the Human path, while playing as Elenor as the Elf path, and not whether you head to the follow Dora's plan, or Draco's plan.
However, I can definitely see what ValHallen meant the with human path.
Then again, I did a run-through where as Saren I went to the elves, and as Elenor, I went to the Empire...mostly to see if Aleema had written in some of the hostility for the PC. (which she did!)
megaman12321Jan 27, 2014
I thought it was just plain called the Human and Elves Path. Was it always Empire?
I mentioned the Empire specifically to hopefully be clear.
I admit, when I think of Human Path, and Elf Path, my mind equates playing as Saren as the Human path, while playing as Elenor as the Elf path, and not whether you head to the follow Dora's plan, or Draco's plan.
However, I can definitely see what meant with ValHallen with human path.
Then again, I did a run-through where as Saren I went to the elves, and as Elenor, I went to the Empire...mostly to see if Aleema had written in some of the hostility for the PC. (which she did!)
The devs think of everything
MiakodaJan 27, 2014
The devs think of everything
If you look at the size of the team that worked on this, I actually am impressed by what they did with Loren.
jack1974Jan 27, 2014
If you look at the size of the team that worked on this, I actually am impressed by what they did with Loren.
Sometimes when I replay the game for testing the 9999th time, I'm impressed by myself too
megaman12321Jan 27, 2014
The devs think of everything
If you look at the size of the team that worked on this, I actually am impressed by what they did with Loren.
Where is the list of all the staff members? I don't really know who does what
AleemaJan 28, 2014
Jack was working on an "About Us" page but then a bunch of things happened. (Good things, but things!) :D
It's usually only one person per role. One artist, one writer, etc. You'll have to watch the credits at the end of games to know who, it changes from project to project.
jack1974Jan 28, 2014
Haha yes, now things are calming down, so I think I'll get to work on the about us page in next days but yes the team apart me, varies from game to game, but if you check each game credits screen/page you'll see the names
MadanceJan 28, 2014
That's a huge amount of work! O_______O
How do you all manage it? It most be complicated, I mean, all the different things that could happen in the game, and characters, and various storylines, and other complications, not to mention the beta-testing and the bug-squashing... It must be overwhelming!
jack1974Jan 28, 2014
It is, that's why I make max 1 RPG a year... the other kind of games are less painful
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